Re: Running Debian without initramfs?
On Thu, 08 Jun 2023 17:13:30 +0200, Sven wrote:
> On 2023-06-08 15:41 +0100, James Addison wrote:
>
> > Does anyone have experience running Debian systems without using an initramfs?
>
> I did this in the distance past, some 15 years ago or so. Have long
> abandoned that idea, though.
>
> > I'd be particularly keen to hear about laptop/desktop/server systems,
> > because I think that a large motivating factor to use initramfs --
> > across many distributions -- was to provide a mechanism
> > outside-the-compiled-kernel to load additional device driver modules,
> > and I'd like to check that that motivation is still valid.
>
> s/device driver//
>
> Loading modules via an intramfs is crucial for a distro kernel, because
> the only alternative would be to compile in support for dozens of
> filesystems that users might want to use as their root filesystem.
Thanks for the response and correction.
So, in order to load a chain of kernel modules (block I/O, logical
disk management, filesystem, ...) that can read the system's 'true'
root filesystem, we frequently (for example, after installation of
some packages) rebuild a second, separate root filesystem (the
initramfs), written according to a built-in kernel filesystem format,
and then subsequently re-read (often from a separate block device) and
re-evaluate the code from that filesystem at each system boot.
(further corrections may be required)
That was my understanding from around the same time you last loaded a
system without an initramfs, and it puzzled me a bit, but I let it
pass (there are only so many technical things that it's possible to
care about, especially with full-time employment).
Basically what I'm wondering about is whether there's some kind of
future utopia where operating system filesystem images -- and the
process of managing and booting from them -- could be made
significantly simpler.
Naturally a block device isn't a game cartridge - the former could
contain many different operating systems, with the potential for
dynamic resizing. But it feels like we haven't landed on the simplest
way to approximate the straightforward (and I think generally fairly
efficient and safe) experience of choosing and loading game cartridges
with boot configuration. It's not a criticism of Debian per-se - we
are following standards as opposed to setting them.
I guess I'm curious whether it could be time to start reversing the
polarity of some open source development experience to feed them back
into simpler standards that provide what we want while discarding the
cruft that doesn't -- based on practical and proven experience --
doesn't work so well.
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